How does buyeuropean even suggest any stance towards anything happening in West Asia?
Edit: i just wanted to snark at weird people in the OP and i didn’t think this would be somehow controversial. i’m on your and palestine’s side but i’m in no mental shape for this discussion and trying to explain what i mean further so i’m out.
Because boycotts are a relevant and powerful tool and part of being a thoughtful consumer is being educated on the ethics of the companies you’re monetarily supporting. That would be my guess anyway.
I don’t disagree at all, I just don’t see the connection between being a thoughtful consumer and any opinion on what Israel is doing in Palestine whatsoever. Those are two different things in my mind. I am very open to being educated.
Well, if business does… well, business with countries or other organizations actively involved in crimes against humanity - it really should affect their most prized possession in a negative way - the profit margins.
In Europe it should come down to inspecting individual companies for their conduct and judging how ethical it is - on a scale from Nestle to ethical.
So, for example, if company didn’t pull out from Israel (or Russia back in '22) - that’s a point in Nestle direction.
If you want to be a thoughtful consumer, it means you got to be thinking about something more than just the price and your perceived use of a product.
There must be some ethical consideration that also influences your purchase. So we need to talk about which ethical considerations are important and not aiding and abetting Israeli crimes through financing their economy or companies that provide them with arms or other military use items, is a quite important ethical consideration.
Taking note of the resolutions of the Security Council and General Assembly, the Court
is of the view that Member States are under an obligation not to recognize any changes in the physical
character or demographic composition, institutional structure or status of the territory occupied by
Israel on 5 June 1967, including East Jerusalem, except as agreed by the parties through negotiations
and to distinguish in their dealings with Israel between the territory of the State of Israel and the
Palestinian territory occupied since 1967. The Court considers that the duty of distinguishing
dealings with Israel between its own territory and the Occupied Palestinian Territory encompasses,
inter alia, the obligation to abstain from treaty relations with Israel in all cases in which it purports
to act on behalf of the Occupied Palestinian Territory or a part thereof on matters concerning the
Occupied Palestinian Territory or a part of its territory; to abstain from entering into economic or
trade dealings with Israel concerning the Occupied Palestinian Territory or parts thereof which may
entrench its unlawful presence in the territory; to abstain, in the establishment and maintenance of
diplomatic missions in Israel, from any recognition of its illegal presence in the Occupied Palestinian
Territory; and to take steps to prevent trade or investment relations that assist in the maintenance of
the illegal situation created by Israel in the Occupied Palestinian Territory
Now the ICJ ruled on the obligation of states, but the underlying principle is clear. If the states are obliged “to prevent trade or investment relations that assist in the maintenance of the illegal situation created by Israel…”, the trade itself is illegal.
Europe is a major buyer of goods produced in Occupied Palestine. The Occupation regime of west palestine gets material support for their ongoing genocide through tariffs and taxes on these products. Buying products labelled “made in Israel [sic]” materially supports the murder and systematic starvation of children.
Further a lot of “made in europe” products source their stuff from occupied palestine, please refer to https://bdsmovement.net/ if you want to help cut off aid to the genocidal entity.
Also yeah, I think its ok to be “obsessed” with an ongoing genocide especially when it seems like everyone around me seems to have forgotten that currently there are kids being maimed, starved and shot. It’s maddening as a parent to see everyone just go about their daily lives as if nothing was happening.
Many companies globally are active participants in the ethnic cleansing and genocide of Palestine either through direct support or partnerships. The BDS Movement exists for a reason.
I don’t think trying to be a thoughtful consumer necessarily implies any opinion in regards to Palestine. One does not follow from the other.
Of course, I personally do think it makes sense to also support Palestinians and want the IDF to fuck off out of there - because that’s my opinion so obviously I think it makes the most sense (why else would that be my opinion). But I’m very certain there are people who want to consume thoughtfully and also support Israel (and there is no contradiction in this that I can see). Again, not me.
All I’m saying is that these are separate things that don’t affect each other (at least not directly). I don’t understand how the people in OP’s post come to the conclusion that buyeuropean=zionist. I also wouldn’t understand if they concluded buyeuropean=non-zionist (but it would make a bit more sense to me personally because I’m biased towards my own opinion, as is everyone).
Perhaps I’m misunderstanding something somewhere. The original post seems to be saying, “don’t assume just because we support buying European we support Israel/Zionism”.
Movements that lean towards buying local often have a political leaning as well, I know that’s often the case in the US anyway that they lean right-wing (but not always like many union workers who support buying domestically but lean left).
I think the post is, “yeah we support X movement but we also support Y. Don’t assume you’re welcome here with that bullshit.” Which we’re on Lemmy, so it makes perfect sense a “buy local” movement would not support Zionism and modern settler colonialism.
Why is it not ok to buy from the US but it is ok to buy from an occupation regime that is currently starving, maiming and shooting children? Genuinely curious, the occupation regime of west palestines evil is way more out in the open than the US’s.
Well yes, but “I don’t want to buy American but European instead and the reason is that Europe supports Israel” would be a weird stance because the US too has been supportive of Israel historically, regardless of where people are from.
How does buyeuropean even suggest any stance towards anything happening in West Asia?
Edit: i just wanted to snark at weird people in the OP and i didn’t think this would be somehow controversial. i’m on your and palestine’s side but i’m in no mental shape for this discussion and trying to explain what i mean further so i’m out.
Because boycotts are a relevant and powerful tool and part of being a thoughtful consumer is being educated on the ethics of the companies you’re monetarily supporting. That would be my guess anyway.
I don’t disagree at all, I just don’t see the connection between being a thoughtful consumer and any opinion on what Israel is doing in Palestine whatsoever. Those are two different things in my mind. I am very open to being educated.
Well, if business does… well, business with countries or other organizations actively involved in crimes against humanity - it really should affect their most prized possession in a negative way - the profit margins.
In Europe it should come down to inspecting individual companies for their conduct and judging how ethical it is - on a scale from Nestle to ethical.
So, for example, if company didn’t pull out from Israel (or Russia back in '22) - that’s a point in Nestle direction.
If you want to be a thoughtful consumer, it means you got to be thinking about something more than just the price and your perceived use of a product.
There must be some ethical consideration that also influences your purchase. So we need to talk about which ethical considerations are important and not aiding and abetting Israeli crimes through financing their economy or companies that provide them with arms or other military use items, is a quite important ethical consideration.
It is also a legal obligation as the ICJ ruled https://www.icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/186/186-20240719-adv-01-00-en.pdf:
Now the ICJ ruled on the obligation of states, but the underlying principle is clear. If the states are obliged “to prevent trade or investment relations that assist in the maintenance of the illegal situation created by Israel…”, the trade itself is illegal.
@Lumidaub @unconsequential
I don’t see the connection either. Some people are just obsessed with certain topics.
Gonna copy my comment here as well
Europe is a major buyer of goods produced in Occupied Palestine. The Occupation regime of west palestine gets material support for their ongoing genocide through tariffs and taxes on these products. Buying products labelled “made in Israel [sic]” materially supports the murder and systematic starvation of children.
Further a lot of “made in europe” products source their stuff from occupied palestine, please refer to https://bdsmovement.net/ if you want to help cut off aid to the genocidal entity.
Also yeah, I think its ok to be “obsessed” with an ongoing genocide especially when it seems like everyone around me seems to have forgotten that currently there are kids being maimed, starved and shot. It’s maddening as a parent to see everyone just go about their daily lives as if nothing was happening.
So you are ok with monetarily contributing to genocide?
… What.
Many companies globally are active participants in the ethnic cleansing and genocide of Palestine either through direct support or partnerships. The BDS Movement exists for a reason.
Yes. I know. I’m not making myself clear.
I don’t think trying to be a thoughtful consumer necessarily implies any opinion in regards to Palestine. One does not follow from the other.
Of course, I personally do think it makes sense to also support Palestinians and want the IDF to fuck off out of there - because that’s my opinion so obviously I think it makes the most sense (why else would that be my opinion). But I’m very certain there are people who want to consume thoughtfully and also support Israel (and there is no contradiction in this that I can see). Again, not me.
All I’m saying is that these are separate things that don’t affect each other (at least not directly). I don’t understand how the people in OP’s post come to the conclusion that buyeuropean=zionist. I also wouldn’t understand if they concluded buyeuropean=non-zionist (but it would make a bit more sense to me personally because I’m biased towards my own opinion, as is everyone).
Perhaps I’m misunderstanding something somewhere. The original post seems to be saying, “don’t assume just because we support buying European we support Israel/Zionism”.
Movements that lean towards buying local often have a political leaning as well, I know that’s often the case in the US anyway that they lean right-wing (but not always like many union workers who support buying domestically but lean left).
I think the post is, “yeah we support X movement but we also support Y. Don’t assume you’re welcome here with that bullshit.” Which we’re on Lemmy, so it makes perfect sense a “buy local” movement would not support Zionism and modern settler colonialism.
Why is it not ok to buy from the US but it is ok to buy from an occupation regime that is currently starving, maiming and shooting children? Genuinely curious, the occupation regime of west palestines evil is way more out in the open than the US’s.
I did not say that and I don’t know where you got that from.
I assume because most European countries have, at least until very recently, been staunch supporters of Israel.
Same for the US though, no?
I assume most people coming to “buy European” are either not American, considering the primary purpose of this Community is to avoid buying American…
Well yes, but “I don’t want to buy American but European instead and the reason is that Europe supports Israel” would be a weird stance because the US too has been supportive of Israel historically, regardless of where people are from.
That’s not how I read the OP. It was more “I want to buy European, but I’m wary that by doing it I might continue to support Israel.”
I would prefer my dollars go to the most ethical countries sure.
My hoser moment 🤡🇨🇦
Disclaimer that I’m not from the EU, but it’s a financial union, so does it really make a difference?
Edit: does it make a difference which EU country is supported, not whether personal consumption choices matter
The primary purpose of this community is to buy European.
I would’ve thought that was obvious.
Except for of course, all the European countries who have recognized Palestina as a country.
What a great bunch of heroes. It only took 50k death
Europeans are such twats about it…
Did something decades too late then huge pats on the back
Same thing with ukraine war and privacy.
We got gdpr so we good in privacy… As their clown regimes ram chat control up their asses.
I am sure they will issue stern comments while selling weapons for the genocide.
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Just fyi this is the society you’re asking them to make peace with
Yes the colonized can free themselves by making peace with the colonizer 🙄, see for example: the us, canada, australia, south africa.
Russia
Huh?
Because we send weapons there? You can either be isolationist OR sell guns, not both
Israeli do “buy europeans” all rightL https://www.ontheditch.com/weapons-worth/
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