🇮🇹 🇪🇪 🖥
Note that both the answers are independent on whether the stalker is a man or not.
Yes, because “men” is such a stringent definition for a hedgemonic class. Half the population on earth, across different social statuses, nationalities, wealth, race, age, and so on. Honestly, claiming this is the “group in power” is absurd.
A completely poor analysis, what there is to reflect on?
Ironically that poster is an Israel supporter. By their own logic every Israeli should be victim of default “suspicion” and be treated like an IDF war criminal, since everyone has the “potential” to be one.
Actually, this argument would be even more compelling since Israel does have elections and you can emigrate/renounce to your citizenship, both not possible in case of manhood.
It’s bizarre that someone could come up with such a poor argument that ultimately boils down to: “people should be accountable for the actions of other people in the same demographic”, without realising there are tons of way you can divide people in demographics.
What places do you go? My pool is super chill, I have seen all kind of uplifting moments. Maybe certain gyms have a selection bias? I don’t know.
Precisely. It’s completely different from doing that in your group of friends, where confrontation is a way to establish common values, and in an internet cesspool where anyway I am going to be moderated out.
Just yesterday I was reading a great article about how social medias compare to TV when it comes to feeling part of a group. “Calling out” people in such places wouldn’t be anything else that virtue signaling (to yourself) to reaffirm your own identity (I stand up to sexism), and at the same time allow those people to reaffirm themselves (I get confronted because I am speaking truth).
Basically it would be at most a performance.
So you need a coordinated effort of thousands of people who will get continuously moderated, banned or censored. OK, I admit that it’s possible, but I think I’d rather invest my time in other ways…
because at least all men share the potential to act out problematic gender roles
Everyone (literally) has the potential to act out problematic gender roles, women included.
protect other men from female criticism because “they are different”
This sentence is legit incoherent. If a criticism doesn’t apply to someone, protecting against said criticism is quite literally preventing discrimination.
If men want to get rid of the collective suspicions
Or maybe we can criticize unfair collective suspicion in the same way summary judgments based on other categories are crticizised. I really can’t see how this argument does not lead to racism, sexism, etc. Being a man is not being part of a club, you don’t decide to join, you don’t subscribe to any value, you don’t have a steering committee that decides how “manhood” is by vote. Why tf anybody should be responsible to change a group that they are part of simply for biological reasons?
Several studies also describe the backfire effect, I.e., people getting more entrenched in their position when confronted with opposing arguments. I doubt I can ever succeed where a decade+ of education system failed.
Also why would I ever recognize a space like that and not run away. “Calling out” is still participation, and why would I want to participate (incl. from the legal perspective). I have the moral obligation to do that because…I am man? As if being a man was being part of a club.
Worth adding that yesterday morning the national alert system was used to broadcast a message to every phone in Rome, with some informatin about the disruption.
and you brought in another issue caused by the same toxic masculinity
To be clear, someone else did.
The fact that someone answered to “actually males are more likely to experience violence” with “eh, but go look who does that violence” prompted my comment.
And it almost sounds like somehow the focus switched from the victim to the cause, when the victims are men. This is the cause why I decided to comment. Almost like violence and protection of who experiences matters depending on who is experiencing it, as if there would be any difference from a woman or a man experiencing violence, whether it is from a man or a woman.
However what you are doing here is either trying to derail the conversation, or making it about something that wasn’t the original convo
If this is your argument, it is a weak one, because I specifically commented in a child thread about this very topic, in response to a very dismissive comment (from my POV). There is no conversation that I am hijacking nor it was me who brought up violence on men on the first place.
However doing it by attacking/derailing women complaining about the same issues is not
Thankfully neither happened.
Sure, but that’s not the perspective of someone who is experiencing violence.
Someone said “men are more likely to experience violence” and the fact that this violence is also coming from men doesn’t change much. There is no ‘men convention’ where it’s put up to votes the way men collectively will act - unfortunately.
Nice, does it depend maybe on the terrain as well (NL is flat, but I was in southern towns and they were a bit hilly).
Anyway, I 100% agree that safe infrastructure is a necessary condition for bike usage. But I look at Rome for example and I can’t imagine elder people biking (even if there was infrastructure) without ebikes, due to so many hills - let alone smaller towns in the inland.
You’re feeling unsafe because of social class or nationality or another factor.
Not in this case. I just do not feel safe because crime exists, and I can become a victim roughly as much as anybody else (probably slightly less than an elder person, in some cases for example). Some other people might have additional worries (like being attacked for racial motives), of course.
That does not mean you do not benefit from being male in a world ultimately built around men.
Which is something I have never claimed. What I challenged is the view that such privilege materializes in being able to roam free and fearless everywhere and whenever.
I’m just not exactly worried about someone stalking or kidnapping me over it.
Of course, there might be a qualitative difference in which worries I have vs someone else, but the original comment suggested “not worrying”, which I find it absolutely unrealistic.
I went biking in NL last summer (great vacation!) and I was completely amazed by the number of elders biking using ebikes. Ebikes absolutely make cycling available to a vast range of people who wouldn’t or couldn’t bike otherwise.
I do have and use a traditional bike, but I will consider in the future a (cargo?)ebike.
after all, I don’t feel afraid to walk home at 1am
That is not because you are part of a “class”. It might be your fully personal thing, it depends on your previous experiences, it depends on where you live or go (and this can also be an expression of being in a privileged social class), etc.
Depending on where I go, I do not feel safe walking alone all the time. I do not consider being sexually assaulted among the possibilities, but instead perhaps being mugged, or be bothered by someone looking for trouble or wanting to feel “alpha male” (as someone who grew up in rough neighborhoods, this is way too common during teen years).
I really don’t understand where this idea that males have the privilege of going outside without ever worrying about anything comes from. I have seen it multiple times in discussions around this topic.
For amybody experiencing violence, how is that important?
It is generally used similarly to “life goes on”. Even if with more pessimism about the fact that certain things don’t change (sometimes for good though).
It is still going to be a big deal for a few weeks though…
A very old one indeed. It’s never certain how conclaves will go.
Oh, I guess different school systems, so that didn’t even come to mind to me. At least in my country high school is from 15 to 19, I think lots of people thankfully mature and change after teenage years.